Kim Min-ha
- It's a shame that by-elections are overheating.The Democratic Party of Korea-Innovation Party has been sucked into all agendas with 'cash support'
- 檢, Lee Jae-myung 'perjury teacher' charges are likely to inevitably cause political controversy during the trial.
- Lee Jae-myung trial, it is confusing in many ways from the public's point of view.Quick conclusion infield
◆ [YTN Radio SHINYUL's news]
■ Broadcasting: FM 94.5 (17:00-19:00)
■ Air date: September 30, 2024 (Monday)
■ Proceedings: Shin Yul, Professor of Political Science and Diplomacy at Myongji University
■ Dialogue: Jang Sung-chul, Director of Public Opinion Center, Kim Min-ha, Current Affairs Critic
* The text below may differ from the actual broadcast content, so please check the broadcast for more accurate information.
◇ Sin-ryul: It's so stately that it feels like it's being weighed down by signal music, so the music is good, but it's very stately and serious, but we're going to be with you two who are seriously trying not to approach all the issues. Let's introduce them one by one. a political Kim & Chang First, Jang Sung-chul, director of the Public Opinion Center, is here. How are you?
◆ Jang Seong-cheol: Hello. I'm Jang Sung-chul, the critic's bad-mouth.
◇ Sin-ryul: Don't provoke me. And Kim Min-ha's current affairs review is here. Please come in.
◈ Kim Min-ha: Hello. If you just hear the signal, the name of the segment is almost not Politics Kim & Chang, but Politics Armageddon, so I don't know what to do.
◇ Shin Yul: We have to talk about it today. According to my calculation, it is predicted that the result of the final trial on Lee Jae-myung's perjury teacher charge will be released by around 5:30 p.m. First of all, what do you think about this part?
◆ Jang Sung-cheol: It is difficult to predict this part because I am not a lawyer majoring in law, but many lawyers say that this is quite likely to be guilty because Lee Jae-myung's testimony was made regarding the perjury teacher charge. In the last violation of the Public Official Election Act, the prosecution demanded the maximum sentence of two years. So, in the case of perjury teachers this time, five years is the maximum amount of life. Then, I expect that the prosecution's sentence will be equivalent to that. So I think crime has become a calling. So, the arrest agreement was approved by the National Assembly last time with this case, but it was rejected by the court. At that time, the judge said that crime becomes a calling and charges become a calling. Looking at that, it seems that judges also judge that they are guilty in this area to some extent.
◇ Sin Yul: What do you think? Our critic, Kim Minha.
◈ Kim Min-ha: I didn't major in law either, so it's a little hard to clearly judge the legal issues of this. As you said, I understand that the legal profession and other areas related to perjury have made such judgments as whether they are relatively likely to be guilty. As you just said, last time, the restraint related
◇ Shin Yul: The judge in charge of warrants said
◈ Kim Min-ha: The judge made a lot of judgments about the possibility of that because he used the expression, "The charges are cleared," but that's now the judge's judgment, and the judgment that the court can make throughout the trial may be different. I think we have to wait and see until the end, but the prosecution claims that this is a very serious crime, so the sentence itself seems to be strong. So I think we need to see it until the end, but I think it's a little tiring politically. These trials. So, this incident itself happened 20 years ago, and we've been talking about what happened 20 years ago in 2018, right? And the form of this trial and the form of controversy itself are also questioning what it meant to say at the time. So, since there are aspects that the people are getting tired of, the judgment should be made in a way that draws a conclusion quickly, whether it's in this direction or that direction. That's what I think.
◆ Jang Seong-cheol: I'm not tired. CEO Lee Jae-myung is getting tired. So, while saying that this was 20 years ago and it happened in 2016 and 2018, it seems that they are talking about the injustice of the prosecution's prosecution or trial with a little nuance, but I think that those who are in charge of public office, who will be representatives of the people, and those who think they will be representatives of the people, should be thoroughly verified in the past. So if it's in the past, even if it's past, it's clearly investigated, investigated, and if there's a legal problem, you have to prosecute it. You have to go to trial.
◇ Shin Yul: Let me ask you about each scenario. Not guilty. So, for example, there is a possibility that the prosecution may say that it is innocent. That's why we're trying to weigh each scenario. But if you're found guilty, then there's an old two-year one. Assuming that this is guilty and guilty will result in a sentence of more than imprisonment, would the Democratic Party be shaken? How do you see it?
◈ Kim Min-ha: Conditions that can be shaken are formed, but Lee Jae-myung's side now has to go all the way to the Supreme Court. With this logic, we have to wait and see. With this logic, for now, the prosecutor has made excessive claims while breaking through the logic of the situation. You're trying to break through with this logic. At the same time, he has made a lot of such claims in trials, right? For example, some of the transcripts are now long, but some parts are now cut, for example, to unfairly emphasize certain contexts in those parts. He is making these claims, but as he continues to repeat them, the DP's operation is still justified, as the next trial may draw an unexpected conclusion, even though Lee Jae-myung was convicted as he said in this ruling anyway. In order to break through this logic politically, the forces on the other side must be organized in a substantive form. But isn't it a situation where you can't do that after the general election last time? So, there may be various controversies, such as a drop in the overall Democratic Party's approval rating or faltering its supporters, but I think that the structure of the Democratic Party, centered on representative Lee Jae-myung, is not fundamentally shaken.
◇ Sin Yul: How do you watch it? If a conviction comes out and a sentence of imprisonment or higher comes out, it's okay.
◆ Jang Sung-chul: I almost completely agree with critic Kim Min-ha's words, and I think that's right for such an analysis, but it's going to be bad if many things overlap. So, if the Democratic Party candidate is not elected in the Gokseong Yeonggwang County election on October 16, and the Cho Kuk Innovation Party candidate or the Democratic Party independent candidate is elected, people in Honam think differently about Lee Jae-myung. when many things overlap Then, Honam should be based on support, but I don't think Lee Jae-myung can do it in Honam. If this atmosphere comes out, it seems that the public opinion risk in Honam will be greater than the risk of trial. The party leader Lee Jae-myung's system will not be shaken simply by the jurisdiction, but if this shakes the public sentiment in Honam, it could be quite a crisis for Lee Jae-myung.
◇ Shin Yul: You just said that, what do you think will happen to this by-election? I'm not saying to predict the result. Looking at the way it's going, I think some strange things are happening. The government should pay 1 million won to the public for basic income. Things that I've never heard of are happening, and we're coming out like 20 more now. How do you see this?
◈ Kim Min-ha: In the background of such a claim, there are various loopholes or limitations in the local government system. It seems that the characteristics of the local government are overlapped and affected. Now, there is a problem with all the agendas being sucked into by such cash and welfare. For example, how can we solve all the problems of the local government with cash benefits or something like that? Rather, in running a local government as a whole, we have to discuss what the problems are now and how to solve them with sincerity, but it's not. Basically. I think it's a shame in that regard, but what the by-elections mean is that the by-elections itself may be inappropriate to judge the value based on itself, but there is a feeling that it is a little overheated. So, in fact, with Yeonggwang-gun, Gokseong-gun, Busan's Geumjeong-gu, and Ganghwa-gun, we are talking like this in the media as if the fate of each political force is at stake. In fact, it is not a matter to be considered that much when objectively evaluating the size of the local governments and the size of the authority that the county and district chiefs have. In principle, this should be a bit of a commentary when we talk about how to actually operate local governments. So I think that those are the problems caused by overheating, but nevertheless, politics is a reality, so in reality, there is also an environment in which some political interpretations have to be added. In particular, the current Yoon Suk Yeol regime is being evaluated in many ways, in many ways, by the polls and the events on the table, in terms of past general elections, the so-called judgment of the regime, and what to do with the regime. Since that composition itself is now in place, it is a condition that cannot be ignored. I think it's a bit unfortunate that we can't ignore that because these things appear in combination and there's an overheated atmosphere.
◆ Jang Sung-chul: It's not a pity, but this is a crazy thing going on. So Yeonggwang-gun's financial independence is 11.7%. So if you look at the various taxes and income collected by Yeonggwang-gun as of last year, It's 97.2 billion won. But if you give 1 million won to more than 50,000 Yeonggwang residents, it would be more than 50 billion won. Then you can't even give me a civil servant's salary. This means that the local government called Yeonggwang-gun cannot be maintained. Candidates who make these empty promises and deceive the people are not qualified as candidates for the Democratic Party or the Cho Kuk Innovation Party itself. We need to disqualify the candidates. I'd like to say that.
◇ Shin Yul: But you mentioned the conditions right now, for example, there are conditions that are bound to overheat like this right now. You said this, and the other thing you said is that various stories of the Yoon Suk Yeol regime are bound to be on the table, so let's talk about that table for a while. There's an investigation review committee called Susimawi. I don't know how to interpret this, because the committee regarding Kim Gun-hee suggested not to prosecute, but the committee regarding Pastor Choi Jae-young actually expressed the opinion of prosecution. How do you see it? What do you think the prosecution will do about this indictment? How do you see it?
◈ Kim Min-ha: Judging from the reports now, isn't the prosecution at a crossroads by prosecuting Pastor Choi Jae-young as intended for investigation and deliberation, or just not prosecuting Kim Gun-hee in a fair manner despite the possibility of various criticisms? But if you look at the report, isn't it that the investigation team has organized it toward non-prosecution, and the final decision of the prosecutor general who has been briefed on it is left? So it actually looks weird right now. Because until now, the prosecution's investigation deliberation is not a prosecution, although many professional people will be involved, right? The investigation and deliberation committee is not a prosecutor, but even people who are not prosecutors said that it is necessary to prosecute this. However, there has never been an example of a prosecutor in that group deciding that this is not a matter to prosecute, regardless of the prosecutor's purpose of prosecution. There has never been such an example, but isn't it said that there is a high possibility that the prosecution will be settled regardless of such a thing? But in conclusion, I don't know legally if the picture becomes like this, but legally, they talked about a lot of issues. We talk about each provision of the anti-graft law, and for example, the recipient talks about this. It's a complicated story right now, but there are some people who argue that the recipient should not receive it in relation to his or her job, but the person who gives it can make a different judgment on the basis that there is no such provision, and aside from that, the public's view is that this is such a problem that eventually arises by not prosecuting Kim Gun-hee.
◇ Sin Yul: That's the news that just came in. The sentence was dropped at the first trial. There is news that the prosecution has demanded a three-year prison term for CEO Lee Jae-myung. I'll turn to this again. He was sentenced to three years in prison. What do you think? Director Jang Sung-chul?
◆ Jang Sung-cheol: It seems that the sentence is a little lower than five years, but the prosecution seems to be convinced of the perjury charge. Anyway, I think we need to punish them. I think we need to wait and see how the court will judge this, but I hope CEO Lee Jae-myung doesn't take this approach. A soldier with a gun is a prosecutor with a warrant, and our country has become a session of dictatorship. He denies the allegations outright, saying that the prosecution has compiled a transcript of the call. You have your own skills. There's also circumstantial evidence. If you deny it, the judges will say yes, they deny it, so we should lower the sentence. We should pay a fine. Since we are the leaders of the opposition party, we should run for president in 2027. Should we do this? This is a thorough legal logic, and I hope that Chairman Lee Jae-myung will approach it, and that he will face political strife and his own political retaliation. I hope he doesn't spread his defense logic in that direction.
◈ Kim Min-ha: But what you said is that I think that logic can be used as defense logic. However, I think it can be a problem if you bring that defense logic to the National Assembly and ask the prosecutor to impeach, for example, or scold the judge. But I think that argument in the court is a defense logic to the extent that I can. Because you said there is a transcript and a voice, but CEO Lee Jae-myung's argument is like that. There's a full version of this, and what the prosecutor submitted as evidence is an edited version. I made that argument, so of course, we can now discuss the difference between the full version and the edited version, but since it's about the law, we can't say that in court with our defense logic, and then there's this aspect. As I said at the beginning, the reason why I told you that this is an incident 20 years ago and that it was mentioned in 2018 is because, as critic Jang Sung-chul said earlier, if there is anything clear that is wrong, it should be condemned, and the people need to find out the truth, especially in cases like this, in order for politicians to take the opportunity for the people to make a full judgment. If you say this, I think it's a necessary procedure. However, I think various political controversies will be inevitable as to whether the prosecution approaches it like this with such an intention. In the end, if you look at the process of the trial and things like that so far, the trial that is obsessed with details has gone through a process that is inevitable, and so on, what is the goal as a result, this is the trial that goes to Baekhyun-dong's case. Because Kim In-seop was in the middle of the perjury teacher's process, and Kim In-seop played a role in the Baekhyun-dong case, so CEO Lee Jae-myung and Kim In-seop had a relationship here as well. Then, it came out in the process of trying to go with the story that this is how it is connected to the Baekhyun-dong case. So, for me, the prosecution's prolonged investigation into Daejang-dong, Baekhyun-dong investigation, and as I mentioned earlier, this trial has become so long that the story of the past has become so long that it is not a separate matter from the contents of this investigation, which has to question the meaning of Lee Jae-myung's remarks one by one and what his remarks mean. Why has this been so long? Why has this been so long for so many years now? I'm telling you that the prosecution should look back on what it's doing like this, and furthermore, shouldn't it be a matter of pointing out who put the prosecution in this situation?
◆ Jang Seong-cheol: I think there's something that needs to be corrected. There are two types of transcripts that CEO Lee Jae-myung talks about. For example, this is a 10-minute transcript, but instead of doing the first and the middle one, taking it out in the middle and attaching it like this, if it's 10 minutes, CEO Lee Jae-myung seems to use the expression "weaving" to report only the things related to this case in the middle. Why did the trial drag on so much? Representative Lee Jae-myung dragged on. After applying for a postponement of the trial date, asking for the adoption of new witnesses, and applying for a challenge from the court, the trial has been prolonged like this. So, I think CEO Lee Jae-myung himself is at a disadvantage, so I think he's dragged on a little bit.
◈ Kim Min-ha: I said earlier that we should point out the same thing, and on top of that, this series of investigations and trials is bound to be politically controversial. This case was not done by Lee Jae-myung alone 20 years ago, right? It was done 20 years ago by a KBS producer. And at the time of this case, the PD was actually the one who testified at the core of whether or not he was in a situation where he had to be a perjury teacher at that time. KBS. But I don't know why the producer is in this administration.Ma was successful in another important position, so that's what happened. I'm also telling you that these situations have no choice but to cause political controversy, and in the end, they have gone through political events, trials, and then processes that can only be seen as investigations. In reality, if it's a situation like that, we want the critics to conclude quickly by considering only the legal principles, and the prosecution should wrap up the investigation quickly. In the end, what will happen to Baekhyun-dong and what will happen to Daejang-dong? There are still parts that are not finished. It's like the last chapter of the final opera, isn't it? Because I'm on my way. I say that because it's what remains, but it's an incident that can't happen. Then, we will face a situation where political controversy is inevitable in the future, so I'm asking you at first and saying that it's frustrating and that this is very confusing in many ways from the people's point of view.
◇ Shin-ryul: But one last thing, if I ask you because this is the end of time, there will be no big change in the Democratic Party, but if it is connected to the by-elections, it will be a little explosive if the result of the by-elections comes out against the Democratic Party. You said this, but assuming that it's explosive, who's there? There?
◆ Jang Sung-chul: The alternative is just that if Lee Jae-myung steps back, there will be an alternative.
◇ Synthesis: I don't have it now
◆ Jang Sung-chul: Now is Gyeonggi-do Governor Kim Dong-yeon, Kim Boo-kyum, Park Yong-jin, or who else is there? That's what we do, but we can only fill it if it's empty. It's clogged up right now, but can't we put anything more in it? If it is emptied out on its own, who will be chosen by the people? There is a fierce internal concern about who can rule the country more reasonably and with common sense. So it's hard to predict or predict such things first, but Lee Jae-myung has such a strong fandom and the Democratic Party of Korea members are strongly organized to support Lee Jae-myung. It may be very noisy and difficult, but if this risk of trial now lowers public support and various support. So let's have a bilateral match. People's power candidates or conservative candidates will lose at that time. Lee Jae-myung is not the best runner for us to regain power. If the judgment that he is not a player is proven by objective data such as polls, the Democratic Party of Korea has no choice but to think differently. Why would anyone let him out of the race to lose? It should be then. This is not going to be December this year or January next year. It needs to take some time. That's what I think.
◇ Shin Yul: Okay. Still, we were able to talk about it after this old volume came out, so it was realistic. Let's stop listening to what you said today. Thank you. So far, we have been with Jang Sung-chul, director of the Public Opinion Center, and Kim Min-ha, current affairs critics.
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