◆ [YTN Radio SHINYUL's news]
■ Broadcasting: FM 94.5 (17:00-19:00)
■ Air date: December 4, 2024 (Wednesday)
■ Proceedings: Shin Yul, Professor of Political Science and Diplomacy at Myongji University
■ Talks: Jang Ye-chan, former member of the Supreme Council of the People's Power, Park Sung-min, former member of the Democratic Party of Korea
* The text below may differ from the actual broadcast content, so please check the broadcast for more accurate information.
◇Shinryul: We will start with Yeouido Youth Politics in the first part of the news head-to-head match of Yesinryul. I will introduce the two who will be with me today, and Jang Ye-chan, former member of the Supreme Council of the People's Power, and Park Sung-min, former member of the Democratic Party of Korea, are here. How are you?
◆ Park Sung-min: Hello.
◇Shin Yul: To be honest, I thought I couldn't do the broadcast today. Those young people had a lecture this morning, and students usually stay silent in class. I'm saying that I don't ask questions, but students are asking a lot of questions today. I didn't ask about the content of the class, but about the first emergency martial law they experienced, but I actually experienced emergency martial law when I was a freshman in college after graduating from high school. At that time, former President Park Chung-hee passed away, Chun Doo-hwan did emergency martial law, and at that time, Army Chief of Staff Jeong Seung-hwa was the martial law commander, but I thought it would not be possible to broadcast today. All broadcasts have to be censored. So, it's because the party has been lifted, but Jang Ye-chan, the former supreme council member, is here. Please come in. It must have been your first time experiencing it yesterday, what did you think?
◆Park Sung-min: It's my first time seeing it. I saw it for the first time and experienced it for the first time, and I thought, "Is this the Republic of Korea in 2024?" First of all, I watched it very disastrously. It is questionable whether the president should call him president now, but seeing martial law troops breaking the window and entering the National Assembly as the decree fell, I thought that the president really revolted against the people. There was even a case where soldiers blocked lawmakers from entering. I will continue to ask why the president pushed for these things and what kind of rebellion he staged to deal with the latter because they seemed to be using a military force called martial law to prevent some legitimate exercise of authority and block some constitutional measures that could actually lift martial law. I think the President should take responsibility for yesterday's situation and the situation until early this morning and step down.
◇ Shin Yul: What do you think of our Supreme Council member Jang Ye-chan?
□Jang Ye-chan: This is hard to say. Obviously, the situation is so serious and serious that we should put our heads together for a calm settlement. However, according to the statement to the public yesterday, the Yoon Suk Yeol administration seems to have implemented this measure under the desperate judgment that 22 impeachment cases and a reduction in special activity costs not only for the presidential office but also for the Board of Audit and Inspection, prosecutors, and police have paralyzed the administrative and investigative functions of any country. As you may have seen, more than half of the lawmakers gathered at the National Assembly to decide on the lifting of martial law, and immediately after the resolution, the martial law situation was lifted by the parliamentary session. So, Mayor Oh Se-hoon and other leading politicians of the ruling party are also making their position today, and overall, Mayor Oh Se-hoon also said that a certain bulletproof National Assembly against Chairman Lee Jae-myung is the cause of this emergency martial law. However, I think it's not right for this martial law itself, and those involved should be held accountable. So I think it's a very difficult situation for me to say anything.
◇ Shin-ryul: Of course, that's possible, but since then, martial law has been enforced. What do you think?
◆Park Sung-min: That's ridiculous. It's ridiculous, and the president has said that he is a constitutionalist. But he showed himself that it wasn't. You've destroyed this constitution. There are requirements for this emergency martial law. If you look at the Constitution, it's Article 77 of the Constitution. What's there is when the president needs to maintain public well-being or military needs as a force in an event of war or an equivalent state of emergency. But whether the emergency martial law declared yesterday has this legitimacy, the National Assembly can criticize any opposition party's political behavior toward the opposition party. You can be dissatisfied from the passport's point of view and from the government's point of view. But it's a completely different matter to criticize it politically and to declare an emergency decree on this part to limit the basic rights of the people, to restrict freedom of speech and publication, and to restrict the legitimate activities of lawmakers. I cannot justify the emergency decree declared by the President yesterday for any reason.
◇ Shin Yul: What do you think is the reason?
◆Park Sung-min: Honestly, it's a bigger problem that I don't know why. Because when the president lifted martial law yesterday, I watched it live, and he still emphasized some justification for emergency martial law. So I was angry once more when I saw him not apologizing to the people while emphasizing its legitimacy, but I don't know why. To be honest, I'm saying that I don't know why I made this choice, regardless of whether I'm a woman or a woman in politics. So, some people are saying that the worst move was taken to protect Kim Gun-hee, but I don't want to give a narrative. The President made a very wrong and very wrong judgment. So, what opposition parties and lawmakers can do by exercising their power properly, such as budget cuts and impeachment, is a political power that lawmakers have, and it doesn't make sense to use it as an excuse to declare emergency martial law that threatens the basic rights of some people. This is not justified for any reason.
□Jang Ye-chan: Now I'm not going to refute it. I think it's a little inconsistent reasoning to ask if it's related to the special prosecutor Kim Gun-hee. Before yesterday, there were many people who opposed the special prosecution, and Chairman Han Dong-hoon and his close circle talked about strategic ambiguity, but the suspension was that they would not pass the special prosecution after the parliamentary meeting. As you know, it is now more difficult to prevent the re-decision of the special prosecutor's vote after the emergency martial law and its lifting, so that is not the main reason in common sense. Since the opposition parties are not only accusing the president of impeachment, it should be judged by the Constitutional Court, the Board of Audit and Inspection, the prosecution and the police, and today's impeachment of the presidential office, the presidential office, the presidential office, the National Prosecutor's Office, the National Prosecutor's Office, the National Prosecutor's Office, and the president's office was announced today. I think the president made this choice to show the public how paralyzed the administrative function is. Simply blocking the independent counsel does not mean that it is blocked. Rather, it will have a more negative impact on the independent counsel's vote, and it seems to be the difference between 22 impeachment of administrative paralysis and what kind of budget reduction will be considered as an emergency at which the police prosecution's activities, including the nation's security function, will be impossible.
◇ Shin Yul: By the way. It's kind of connected to what the reason is. As I said before, I went through martial law when I was very young, but if I think back to that time, the area where I lived at that time was near Cheong Wa Dae. But first of all, the tanks are arranged in Gwanghwamun and this side. And as far as I remember, they completely blocked the National Assembly, so the soldiers pulled the National Assembly members out of it. And soldiers do pearls on college campuses. I'm stationed. And of course, there are many media companies now, but I decided that there is a very high possibility that the military will come to at least two media outlets such as public broadcasting, general broadcasting, and press channels. But yesterday, a very close friend of mine was a high-ranking official at a major media company, but he didn't come in, and YTN didn't come in, and no one came in. I felt like I was a little clumsy, but if I was clumsy, isn't this not planned? There might be someone who claims it like this?
◆ Park Sung-min: It's a problem even if it's planned and it's not planned. Whatever it is, it's a problem.
◇ Shin-ryul: But when you infer the reason, don't you think so? .
◆Park Sung-min: But I think the main purpose was to suppress and suppress the National Assembly. So, as you said, if you look at the dictators who usually promoted martial law because they lacked careful preparation, the media first controls it. It wasn't done very systematically, but rather, where did the military go, where did the military helicopters fly, and where were these soldiers put into, so in fact, a lot of them were deployed to the National Assembly. And now the Democratic Party is saying that there seems to have been a kind of arrest team. Because if you look at the places that these martial law soldiers headed when they broke the window and entered this National Assembly compound, they're headed to Han Dong-hoon's office, Lee Jae-myung's office, and Woo Won-sik's office. Given these reports and the actual analysis, it was apparent that the National Assembly was trying to oppress and tie up the speaker who had the power to hold a plenary session and then political leaders with some leadership from both the ruling and opposition parties. In that sense, I think the president made this happen without consulting with the ruling party, so I think he realized what he had been calling out for as an anti-state force with some great hostility toward Yeouido. So he said he should stop the forces trying to overthrow the system, but as a result, who is the president who created some kind of emergency in the country now? In that sense, I think the president's hostile worldview and very narrow-minded thoughts have created a kind of monstrous behavior.
□Jang Ye-chan: If I take the purpose of Professor Shin-yul's question and add a few words, if I was really willing to block the National Assembly, I would let all the lawmakers in at 10 p.m. on weekdays, and this was the time when people who could not block the National Assembly could leave right after dinner, and an hour after the president's statement to the public, military troops were mobilized. With only horror bullets loaded, it is correct to say that this is inconsistent and sloppy to say that it is to take effect of a practical National Assembly blockade or martial law. There are so many loose things that, in common sense, if there is such an announcement on weekdays, all the lawmakers stay near Seoul and Yeouido on weekdays by the Democratic Party, which controls the majority of the National Assembly, right? If it's the weekend, most of them don't have enough people to come to the National Assembly, but as soon as I saw the announcement, I thought that it would be lifted if the Democratic Party convened lawmakers right away. So, as Professor Shin Yul said, there is a question of why this is not planned or why it is so sloppy.
◇ Shin Yul: So I thought it was very spontaneous. Because I can't confirm whether it's true or not,
□Jang Ye-chan: At the same time, some analysts say that the president has shown a last resort to turn the tide to resist continued impeachment and budget cuts that would paralyze the administration's function and make it impossible to maintain public security, but I don't think it's appropriate for various interpretations and interpretations to add to public confusion. Whether it's late today or tomorrow, the president can talk about the post-war situation of martial law in front of the people and what he's thinking about.
◇ Shinryul: Is it better to do it, not do it?
□Jang Yechan: I think it's necessary to do it. I don't know if it's scheduled or not.
◆Park Sung-min: But what if it was spontaneous? It's not okay. Even if it was spontaneous, it was a final warning. It was a political warning. Does that make sense to declare martial law? The country was in chaos for 150 minutes. Citizens were nervous, and people had to rush to the National Assembly and shout for the president to come down. They said they didn't block the lawmakers from entering. It's all in the video. There is also a scene where lawmaker Lee Jae-jeong is protesting to let him in. We've gone over the councilors' wall.
◇ Synthesis: Correct. But at first, I think I put it in.
◆Park Sung-min: So I did it at first, but I don't know if it's after I proclaimed it or not,
◇ Sin-ryul: The reason I think that's important is the military or the police. I said that because I didn't feel like I was actively carrying out the orders of my superiors.
◆Park Sung-min: Anyway, that behavior can be a problem now. If you look at President Lee's behavior as a crime of rebellion, I think it can be sufficiently a crime of rebellion, but both the military and the police who sympathized with it can be punished. It can be seen as an accomplice. Anyway, such behavior was also very problematic, so even Han Dong-hoon, chairman of the ruling party, pointed out yesterday that the military should not play a role in such behavior. And it doesn't appear that there was only a horror bomb, but it was actually captured distributing live ammunition boxes. He pointed out these parts and said that he received reports that he deployed snipers, so he actually deployed the military to scare some lawmakers, even if they shouldn't. I don't understand that way of thinking, but even if it did, why would military troops break the National Assembly window and enter the main office? I did it to prevent the plenary session. Because this martial law can only be lifted if the plenary session is held, in the end, I would have been the worst if I had run out of time and more troops were put in to stop the plenary session. Because this is a situation where lawmakers could actually be arrested. So, yesterday and until dawn, of course, the situation was lifted quickly, but under no circumstances can this be tolerated. I have to make this clear.
◇ Shin Yul: Personally, I totally agree. But we've done a lot of snatching in the past in our country. If you look at this precedent at that time, it took effect when the speaker of the National Assembly banged the ground with the lawmakers, even if it was outside the plenary session. Fortunately, this was passed yesterday with the approval of all 190 members in the plenary session, but even if I couldn't enter the plenary session, I think I could have protected the speaker, Woo Won-sik, and done it somewhere else. But I have another question now: Chang Ye-chan, the supreme council member, is quitting.
□Jang Ye-chan: I understand that you have expressed your intention to resign en masse.
◇ Shin Yul: Deputy Prime Minister Choi Sang-mok seems to have quit.
□Jang Ye-chan: There are such reports, and what Prime Minister Han Duck-soo said after meeting with Cabinet members today is that the Cabinet should take responsibility and stabilize state affairs in this chaotic situation. For example, even if all members of the State Council resign as a result, I think the first thing to do is to come up with measures to deal with the current situation. Prime Minister Han Deok-soo seems to be taking responsibility for that, and when the members of the State Council express their collective resignation and the resignation is accepted, the ministry will move to the acting vice minister system. Then, regardless of politics, there are things that each ministry has to do to take care of people's livelihoods and the economy during a very important budget season or next year. Since there may be a gap in administrative affairs, it remains to be seen whether all ministers of the State Council will actually resign or take responsibility for the severity of the situation by expressing their resignation. However, even though a very big incident has occurred in the political circle at the National Assembly, I think it is necessary to stabilize the state of affairs by calmly consulting with the presidential office so that the people can feel safe without adding to the confusion. In that sense, Prime Minister Han Deok-soo seems to be taking responsibility now, and the breaking news just released shows that Prime Minister Han Deok-soo, representative Han Dong-hoon, and floor leader Choo Kyung-ho have moved to the presidential office.
◇ Shin Yul: We weren't supposed to meet at 2 o'clock.
□Jang Ye-chan: At 2 o'clock, we met at the Prime Minister's Office. He is expected to move to the presidential office and start a meeting to deal with the situation. Even if it's late today, I think the results of the meeting should be announced to the public and the ruling and opposition parties should put their heads together to create a solution to prevent further confusion after listening to the president's honest remarks on the post-war situation.
◆Park Sung-min: I think the president's honest truth was already shown around 4:30 a.m. today. So you haven't apologized to the people, and you'll be responsible for all these situations you've caused. I'm sorry, but I didn't say anything that felt responsible for this. It was very mechanical. He said he would accept it because the National Assembly asked for it, but he added a word that emphasized the legitimacy and legitimacy of the emergency martial law he made. This is typically the logic that I didn't do anything wrong. I personally have the confidence that the President cannot judge this matter by any normal thinking, and I think it will continue to be the same. That's why I think it's dangerous. So even though this martial law can't be seen as a single happening, it can't be dismissed as a happening anyway, and I even fear that this is a kind of beginning.
◇ Shin Yul: What is it about?
◆Park Sung-min: What some people are talking about now is that although the National Assembly will respond well in all directions while waiting for an emergency,
◇ Credit: Democratic Party lawmakers in three shifts in the plenary session of the National Assembly.
◆Park Sung-min: Like the martial law situation room, if martial law occurs again, it seems that we are thinking about some measures to respond to it. So, since the president was found to be an uncontrollable danger yesterday, what Representative Lee Jae-myung said now is that he is trying to put our country in danger through the war with North Korea. On the other hand, there are many people saying that there is a guarantee that a second or third martial law will not be declared. That's why, despite expecting the president to perform his duties normally under the current circumstances, I think it will be the same as any dialogue with the opposition party or the ruling party since yesterday's emergency martial law has already been created. I would have judged that President Lee is unable to perform his duties normally from the people's point of view. So in the current situation, I don't think there's an answer to this. Either you step down or you're going to impeach.
◇ Shin Yul: But the State Council of the State Council. That's not a voting body, but a deliberation body. But it was reported that the agreement was reached yesterday? But everyone said they opposed it, but of course, the president can't do it just because the members of the State Council opposed it. Because it's a deliberative body
□Jang Ye-chan: I don't think we can find out the truth about the contents of the Cabinet meeting yet because it varies from report to report. However, before the declaration of emergency martial law in our Constitution, we have to hold a Cabinet meeting, and after the National Assembly decides to lift martial law, we have to hold a Cabinet meeting to lift martial law again. It seems that such procedures have been carried out as indicated.
◇ Credit: The National Assembly should be notified immediately. Was it notified if the president did this emergency decree?
□Jang Ye-chan: We haven't received any notice from the office of National Assembly Speaker Woo Won-sik, so I think we need to look at the process of raising issues and notification in the future.
◇ Shin Yul: That's why the impeachment motion has been submitted today. Then, the vote will be held the day after tomorrow. What do you think?
◆ Park Sung-min: I think this will be passed without difficulty, but I think it will be the same within the power of the people. Because it was already far short of opposition lawmakers yesterday, but more than 10 lawmakers attended and 18 lawmakers voted, and if so, I don't think there's any reason to oppose this impeachment if they have a conscience. But what I'm curious about is that they held a general meeting of lawmakers within the power of the people, but I'd like to tell the ruling party to wake up a little bit because they didn't reach an agreement even on the president's request to leave the party. The President is lonely. I should be the president's friend. I heard that you also talked about this, but the people don't care whether it's lonely or something that needs to be talked about. Since we all agree that the president is in a very abnormal state, whether there was an early expulsion of the president or not, it seems that the ruling party's reality is that they have not reached an agreement.
◇ Shin Yul: But only 18 people went. Many things are being said about this, but what do you think, Jang Ye-chan?
□Jang Ye-chan: I think there was a disagreement within the party. In such an emergency situation, lawmakers of the People's Power need to first gather together to gather consensus and make different voices, but to make a single voice. Some people thought it helped stabilize the political situation, and some thought that they should go to the plenary session and exercise a vote to lift martial law with the Democratic Party. At today's general meeting of lawmakers, there seem to be different opinions on the part of Park Sung-min's defection from President Yoon Suk Yeol as mentioned earlier. But since there will be another general meeting of members of the People's Power Congress tonight, we have to wait and see what agreements will come out from there. However, there are some variables because there are two days left in the current atmosphere. For example, there will be individual departure votes, such as Ahn Cheol Soo, who publicly announced that President Yoon Suk Yeol should resign, but in order for this to get more than eight votes, it is necessary to have an official position from the close circle. So I don't think there's a chance of eight votes and nine votes in this impeachment motion. If the position of the close circle is decided to be impeached, there will be about 20 votes, and if the position of the close circle is decided that it is not our impeachment, there will be about three or four individual votes, so this is at the extreme end, and there is no possibility that eight to nine votes will be separated by individual votes. According to Park Jung-hoon, a key member of the close circle, on Facebook today, there seems to be a consensus among the close circle that the impeachment of the president should be prevented, although they are critical of the emergency martial law measure. Of course, there are two days left before the impeachment vote, so there is a consensus that impeachment, not impeachment, should be prevented because the conservative camp has suffered the aftereffects and various wounds from the suspension of the constitution called impeachment, and if there are any other differences between the so-called pro-Yoon-gye and the pro-Park faction in other solutions or probationary measures, I think it will be adjusted through the parliamentary assembly.
◇ Shin Yul: Yes, I understand. The time is up, so I'll stop here for today. So far, I have been with Park Sung-min, former supreme council member of the Democratic Party, and Jang Ye-chan, former supreme council member of the People's Power.
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