If you're sure of something called "delusion?" without doubt or criticism,

- Delusion is a kind of neurosis

- support and hatred for political issues? Don't identify him with me to resolve it.

- You have to try to reduce external stimuli.

[News FM Lee Ik-seon Choi Soo-young Issue & People]
□ Broadcast Date: December 19, 2024 (Thu)
□ Host: Lee Ik-seon, Choi Soo-young
□ Cast: Kim Chul-kwon, professor of psychiatry at Dong-A University Hospital

* The text below may differ from the actual broadcast content, so please check the broadcast for more accurate information.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: Would you like to join us over a cup of tea after lunch? Issue & People's small drawing room Salonde Sangam. It's the end of the year when the emptiness of just letting the year go, the pressure to do better, the deprivation I feel when I see those ahead, and the dizzy political situation are added. We will find out how to fill the hole with Kim Chul-kwon, a professor of psychiatry at Dong-A University Hospital. You've already appeared on our program. <A psychiatrist's 37-year record> He published a four-book book and we had an interview. I'm on the phone. Hello, professor.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: Hello.

◈Choi Soo-young: Nice to meet you. Listening to the professor's rich voice on the phone again makes me feel really comfortable. How have you been?

◇Kim Cheol-kwon: I've been well.

◆Lee Ik-seon: Thank you for calling me because I'm in Busan because I couldn't come due to various schedules. How's the hole in the professor's mind these days? Do you have any?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: Does the size of the hole in your heart change? It's always the same. But the size seems a little different depending on my state of mind. If you think you've lived a good life, you'll look small, and if you don't, the hole will look big, and the day the hole closes completely is when my desire goes out, so that's when I'm going to die.

◈Choi Soo-young: Then I think it's really important to control your mind. It's up to you whether the hole is big or small. What are some wisdom to think small?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: It's very important to watch what goes by. Let's keep some distance. I don't know if that's the right expression, but watching yourself out of fluid...

◈Choi Soo-young: So you're telling me to keep my distance, right?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: It's very important to keep a psychological distance.

◆Lee Ik-seon: So don't try to change the waterways on purpose and look at the waterways. Do you mean to just put it in there?

◇Kim Cheol-kwon: People usually read books such as Laozi and Zhangzi when they get older.

◈Choi Soo-young: That's why he buys a lot. And these days.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: When you are young, books don't come in when your blood boils, but when you get older, don't cut your child's legs because they are long. Take it as it is. A lot of people naturally feel this.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: Listeners, let's take a look at my heart as we listen. I hope you can share your thoughts and concerns about what emotions I often feel these days. I'll also open the YTN app or YouTube comment window.

◈Choi Soo-young: It's the end of the year again. It's going to be New Year's Day again in about 10 days, but the end of the year is the time to wait for the start of the new It has this meaning of hope, but I heard that many people feel a lot of loss and depression that they spend the year. This phenomenon seems to be so common that there is also a name called Holiday Blues in the United States.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: Blue itself means a mild depression. But this blue is very healthy and good. That's why we have blue after giving birth. It gives me an opportunity to think about what it is to be a mother. Also, there is a bean nest blue that appears when your child grows up and leaves your arms. At this time, you're going to visit me, not my parents. So now this blue is kind of a mourning response. It's not pathological because you can see it as a process of overcoming it after you lose something, but it's very good.

◈Choi Soo-young: Then does the professor's love of blue have something to do with these psychological factors?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's right. If it's a deep sea color, this blue symbolizes a lot of sadness. So, is that Kieslovski? In the movie Blue, Red, White, Blue also symbolizes that sadness.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: I see. On the other hand, at the end of the year, looking back on whether I lived a long life or not, I didn't do anything, saying, "Why am I like this?" or why my situation does not change. I think the depression that comes from comparison and achievement also plays a part. Sometimes it feels shabby.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: But actually, what do you have to do? Something like this. Looking back, it's actually great that I've lived a year. It is very important to live three meals without getting into a big accident. So, I feel a lot that what I always feel in the outpatient clinic is that I know that I will be grateful for my daily life if I lose it. In my case, it's very hard, and then I go to the intensive care unit of the hospital. Then, I'm very thankful that I'm alive.

◈Choi Soo-young: I see. As you said, we don't usually feel the importance of air or water, but when we suddenly disappear one day, it's really scary. So, it sounds like you have to continue to feel grateful for your daily life.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's right.

◆Lee Ik-seon: But at some point, I feel like I should be happy at the end of the year, especially before and after Christmas, and I feel like I should go shopping or walk on a fancy street. Otherwise, there are some shabby feelings of unhappiness, but I wonder how I should spend the end of the year or whether I need to have a special mindset at the end of the year. What do you think?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: You have to be happy not only at the end of the year but also at the usual time. It's much healthier mentally to think that instead of doing it, let's not be unhappy.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: Let's not be unhappy.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: So rather than thinking about what to have. What do I have at the moment? I'm glad I didn't lose it. I think it's much more important to write a list of your own than to write a bucket list or a list you want to do. Because most of them have a lot.

◆Lee Ik-seon: Well, when Westerners comfort them, they say "Count Your Bless." The professor said to me to count the blessings you are receiving, but now the professor said that. Come to think of it, I can think of it quickly.

◈Choi Soo-young: I know. Thinking that way, I have so many things.

◆Lee Ik-seon: Isn't society noisy and unstable these days, and people are cutting off conversations or distancing themselves because of ideology? If you look at the news, you have a lot of worries. There's no way I don't watch it. What should I do in this case? This isn't my personal problem.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: It's practically impossible to completely avoid external stimuli. Since living every day itself is stimulated, you should still try to reduce external stimuli. Because it's a matter of time. Because time is the same as our lives, we actually have to give a lot of time to what we think is important. And most of all, you have to know that it's your own mind that's angry. For example, when our Korean society says that some people feel good and others are angry about an incident. Then it's not that there's a problem with the case, but there's a problem with the mind of the person who sees it.

◇Kim Cheol-kwon: So everyone knows that it moves me every time I read it, but it's the skeleton of Ambassador Wonhyo. It depends on how you see it. And since I like movies, there is a very famous movie called 'Verb West Germany' directed by Wang Gawi. As soon as the subtitles start, the opening sequence is over and the flag is stopped, the wind is still, it is only your heart that shakes. It's like this. So, my current heart, my various angry or liking, changes as clouds pass by. It's necessary to look at how you feel right now that you're angry and pat yourself.

◈Choi Soo-young: To tell you the truth, should I call it that law? Or should I call it a four-character idiom? Isn't there a saying that it's all-in-one? Everything depends on thinking and making up your mind, but what the professor says now seems to be in line with this core.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's the core of psychoanalysis. So everything comes from the heart. Outside events do not matter. Then memory also distorts memory from your own desires.

◈Choi Soo-young: Your memory is distorted.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: Memory is absolutely distorted. In the present situation, one's desire is combined, and the event is distorted in the past.

◈Choi Soo-young: It's true that memories can be distorted and refracted.

◇Kim Cheol-kwon: Distorting is desire.

◆Lee Ik-seon: Well, there are times when people talk about things that happened before, they talk about different things.

◈Choi Soo-young: That's right. It's the same issue. Even though it's the same memory.

◆ Interest line: If I go one step further and ask you a question regarding a number of recent political issues, that I support someone, that I hate someone. These things are not very important in my life, but as you said earlier to reduce external stimuli, it seems to be strengthening more and more. In terms of the group. How do I keep this a little distant?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: You have to understand that you like and support a person, and these two problems are emerging now. I am me and you are you. So each person has a different seat. So I look at you from my perspective and you and I are different, but I agree with you. This is the purpose. This is a very healthy thing.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: But the same person is you. So you put yourself in that person's seat and you look at everything from that person's perspective. Don't ask or question, your happiness is my happiness and your unhappiness becomes my unhappiness. This is the identification. But all healthy people support in a fantasy world in their own way. The seats are different for each other. However, the more difficult and unhappy your life is, the more conflicts you have, the more you move in the direction of identification. So he identifies himself and me from his point of view. This is very unhealthy.

◆Lee Ik-seon: So, it's not when your body is comfortable and happy, but rather when you're tired and unhappy, you identify more?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: So the harder your life is, the more fantasies you have, but when it's too hard, you go with the same idea. I talked about it later, but it's a little over the neurosis stage. That's why life is so hard.

◈Choi Soo-young: Professor, how should I separate it? How to live separately without identifying or wisdom?

◇Kim Cheol-kwon: So in the end, rather than wisdom, we need to know first. So psychoanalytically, in psychiatry, we divide it into three categories: symptoms, neurosis, and psychosis, but we actually have no symptoms in our psychoanalysis. The symptoms belong to neurosis, so I only have neurosis and psychosis. But this neurosis, the general public, is full of fantasies. Fantasy. Everything is full of fantasy and the world of psychosis is full of delusions. However, more important than the difference between this fantasy and delusion, the nerve donor always doubts and always wanders because it has an illusion.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: Do you wander after being suspicious?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: He doubts his own thoughts, doubts whether this is right or not, criticizes, and wanders. But I'm sure because psychiatric patients have delusions. That's a huge difference. I don't wander because I'm sure. If you support it, you doubt it even if you support it. If you identify, you have confidence, so you don't doubt it.

◆ Profit line: Oh, my.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's why I say things like, "I'm shaking, I'm distressed, I'm anxious, I'm sad, I'm angry." When you have those thoughts and feelings, oh, I'm normal.

◆Lee Ik-seon: You're kind of healthy.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: You have to think that you are normal. But I'm confident in any ideology or ideology. On the outside, it looks very cool, but when it identifies with the variant, he goes beyond the stage of neurogenesis.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: You're psychotic.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: So it's hard to describe it as psychosis, but it's very unshakable. Even if the other person talks and gives evidence, he or she lives trapped in his or her world. So, as I always say, it's good for us to be shaken and wandering.

◆Lee Ik-seon: Then people talk about fake news a lot these days. Are the people who create fake news also people who are full of this conviction?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's right. You're confident, and that's what you're trying to do to influence and control others. They don't reflect on what they do. So the world is not actually black and white, but most of them are gray. If you break it in two like cutting tofu, it's very easy to cause hostility or anger to the other person. That's why if you say that anger as food, you cook and live. So in a way, the individual's mind is very desolate and devastated.

◈Choi Soo-young: Professor, it's already time to spend the year. There are many people who get angry as a year goes by and they get older. Our Korean-style notation for the Psychiatric Association, 'Hwa-byung'. It is said to have been registered in Korean, but do you think Koreans are more angry in the world even if you look at it on average like this?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: It's possible to misunderstand, but "Hwa" in the vase is actually a physical symptom, not anger. There is a misunderstanding, but when psychological conflict appears as a physical symptom, it is called hwa-byung.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: For example, what are the symptoms?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's because words can't tell you how unfair I was before. This is mainly why the mother-in-law and daughter-in-law or the husband and wife talk about it as a physical symptom. For example, the body becomes paralyzed. It's like having stomach cramps. It's a vase. If Korea can't make its own unfair remarks with words, humans always speak with their bodies if they can't.

◆ Profit line: That's right.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: Very few these days. These days, it's rather the opposite.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: Does it become a psychological factor and come out of the body?

◈Choi Soo-young: We thought it was just a vase to get angry at people.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's not the painter. There's a bit of a misunderstanding.

◆Lee Ik-seon: But it was cool to regret and apologize when I suddenly got so angry and turned around why I wasn't more generous than before, and there are quite a few frustrating situations like this. What advice would you give to these people in your life?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: So what makes you angry is to touch your weak points anyway. For example, if you are a person with very low self-esteem, you are hurt if the other person does not respect you. I have a feeling of inferiority. So when you're angry, you first need to know that something outside touches your weak spot without knowing something. That's very important. However, since anger is an area of emotion, it is important to feel that my wife is angry right now, but most people don't feel it well. So even though the horse is angry, it goes out, so I'm not angry. It's not that I'm angry. This is how you get angry when you look at your face, your attitude, or your way of speaking. You don't know that you're angry.

◆ Proficiency line: By the way. Like social life guidelines. If you look at information about things going around these days, if you keep holding back your anger, you'll be shouted out with cadaver words. So, there are people who give advice that you should get angry properly and draw a line clearly. That's why I don't know the boundaries. When do I have to let them know that I'm angry and when do I have to put up with it?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: If you express your anger when you are angry and the other person is very offended about it, that's not a good way to do it. So anger is a negative emotion. There can be no way to get angry easily because it's a negative emotion. Rather, it is more effective to think about how to convey my uncomfortable feelings to the other person. It's because negative things are negative. It's a joke that you become a watermelon just because you line up with pumpkins. No matter how well you get angry at something negative, the other person gets hurt.

◆Lee Ik-seon: So you have to think about how to convey it well when you have uncomfortable feelings.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's right. It's much better to study such things as communicating uncomfortable emotions well to the other person without getting angry. Straightforwardly, if I pop out that I'm angry, I don't get much after all.

◈Choi Soo-young: That's right. Professor. But let me ask you a question from a medical perspective. Isn't there a clear difference between being angry and being angry? There is a saying that not being able to control emotions is not a psychological problem, but a problem of the frontal lobe. Is this true?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: There are a lot in part. Being angry is the area of emotion, and being angry is the area of action. So anger is an area of emotion. There's that area of controlling emotions. That's usually called the limbic system. Limbig System. Among the limbic system, it is called the amygdala. You don't have to know this. I have no problem living at all. I get angry when the amygdala is stimulated. Then this frontal lobe pats the amygdala, which makes you think and act rationally when you're angry. If you pat him in some way. It's a business that's left to endure. Don't talk to such a man.

◈Choi Soo-young: That's right. That's how you rationalize it.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: Pat him in a way that he can best accept. That's the role of the frontal lobe. But what makes me angry is called the amygdala. So it can be done by activating the frontal lobe, but at the same time, you have to do something like that while making the amygdala less stimulated.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: So what can I do to make my frontal lobe healthier and more active?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: What if activating the frontal lobe is, for example, aimed at calming down anger? As I said before, anger is an emotion. So the way to calm that feeling is action. Just as fire is extinguished with water, it is the easiest way to catch emotions with actions.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: How do you behave?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: So the best thing is deep breathing, which is better than action.

◆ Lee Ik-seon: That's an action.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's right. The difference between sighing and deep breathing. Sighing is unintentional, and deep breathing is intentional breathing while being conscious.

◈Choi Soo-young: Deep breath is what you do with faith.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: Breathe in slowly and exhale slowly. I always hold my emotions with actions. Why do I lose weight when I run when I ask questions? You lose weight because you can't eat it while running.

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: It's best to do something that's compatible with anger. So giving a children's song-singing assignment to a man who couldn't control his anger in a book called 37 years of records in psychiatry. You can't get angry while singing a children's song. In my case, when I'm angry, I brush my teeth momentarily. Why are you brushing your teeth? I can't get angry while I brush my teeth. Anger is a momentary flame. It sinks when that moment passes. So it's best to take a deep breath or take a walk as much as you can. Because it's hard to work. It's possible for me to brush my teeth for a while, so if I put it into action for a while like that, the flames of that anger disappear. You have to keep training it.

◈Choi Soo-young: Okay. Professor, I'd like to ask you a personal question. We're not doing it because we feel like we're losing what we can't have because we're older. There are more people who feel lost in the fact that what I really had is insignificant and useless. If you could give me some advice on this, what would you say?

◇Kim Cheol-kwon: That needs to change the perspective. It depends on how you set your standards. They say they don't have anything compared to other people. In fact, he has a lot of things in other people's eyes. As long as you don't change your perspective, you go into the perspective of desire, so it depends on where you put your standards. It's hard to solve unless it never makes sense and changes how you look at life.

◈Choi Soo-young: Okay.

◆Lee Ik-seon: Professor, you're going to retire next year. What I've been doing all my life, usually ahead of my retirement age. In the case of the professor, it is a little different because he is a doctor, but I think there will be a lot of anxiety that comes to mind when you are an ordinary office worker or have to leave something you have been attached to for a long time. What advice would you give to those people?

◇ Kim Cheol-kwon: That's a child, too. I've been in love for a long time, and I'm letting you go. When you let him go. The overcoming of mourning is the object of which love he administered. It's about taking that energy back to yourself and turning the energy of love to another object, to Libido, to another place. You have to spend another time and find something you can love.

◆ Proficiency line: I see. Lastly, can you say something to our listeners before the end of the year?

◇Kim Cheol-kwon: I think. Since I'm a psychiatrist, I'm talking about various ways to keep my mind stable. The most important thing is to keep your mind stable. All human emotions come from the body. That's actually the case. It's already evident in brain science. So laugh a lot, hold a lot, and move a lot. This is very important. That's why you have to take care of your body warmly. So if you take good care of your body, your mind will also improve by itself.

◈Choi Soo-young: I'll keep that in mind.

◆ Proficiency line: I see. Salonde Sangam and Kim Cheol-kwon, professor of psychiatry at Dong-A University Hospital. He also published a book called A Psychiatrist's 37 Years of Records. It was a phone interview with the professor. Thank you.